- This topic has 24 replies, 10 voices, and was last updated 15 years, 3 months ago by
.
-
Posts
-
If the question is, ‘Will he play up front as part of a 4-4-2?’, then the answer is no, most probably not.
If nothing else, this World Cup has proven that:
4-4-2 is a largely outdated system that few adopt these days. Most play 4-5-1 which converts to 4-3-3 in attack.
Wide players playing on the ‘wrong’ wing can be very effective when cutting inside (see Robben as a prime example).
If playing without traditional wingers, two decent defensive midfielders are essential to provide cover for the centre halves.
(I will save this post and refer back to it sometime in September)
If the question is, ‘Will he play up front as part of a 4-4-2?’, then the answer is no, most probably not.If nothing else, this World Cup has proven that:
4-4-2 is a largely outdated system that few adopt these days. Most play 4-5-1 which converts to 4-3-3 in attack.
Wide players playing on the ‘wrong’ wing can be very effective when cutting inside (see Robben as a prime example).
If playing without traditional wingers, two decent defensive midfielders are essential to provide cover for the centre halves.
(I will save this post and refer back to it sometime in September)
Keep it close, you’ll need it daily once the [s:3ho0bzdx]dark side[/s:3ho0bzdx] season starts ;)
If the lad scored 30-odd goals in 50-odd games last year, it’s fair to say that he will prbablty be leading the line; that record just about pips Rodallega and Scotland’s records, I think. ;)
As Martinez is nailed on to play the same way we played last season, then expect another wide(r)-man signing or more of Rodellega playing on the left.
If the question is, ‘Will he play up front as part of a 4-4-2?’, then the answer is no, most probably not.
If nothing else, this World Cup has proven that:
4-4-2 is a largely outdated system that few adopt these days. Most play 4-5-1 which converts to 4-3-3 in attack.
Wide players playing on the ‘wrong’ wing can be very effective when cutting inside (see Robben as a prime example).
If playing without traditional wingers, two decent defensive midfielders are essential to provide cover for the centre halves.
(I will save this post and refer back to it sometime in September)
Keep it close, you’ll need it daily once the [s:d4m7vduc]dark side[/s:d4m7vduc] season starts ;) [/quote]
It harks back to when Jayt etc met with Martinez, and someone (Natdan?) asked him to put forward the question of ‘Can you give us an example of a team that plays this system successfully?’In hindsight, had this been asked, the perfect answer would have been ‘ Watch the World Cup in June sunshine, and then you tell me’.
Up top on his tod!
As a fully paid up member of the dark side, my argument with Bobby playing 4-5-1 last season was not that the formation “doesn’t work” nor do I believe that that was the argument of the other people who opposed Bobby using it.
My argument then & now is that the formation can be used very successfully BUT that you have to have the players to enable you to play the system successfully.
4-5-1 failed (by & large) for Latics last season because we did not have a striker capable of playing that lone striker role. Scotland wasn’t & never will be good enough for the top flight & Rodallega, whilst having the talent to make it in this league doesn’t have the attributes to play that role
On top of that, we didn’t have anyone (with Bobby’s insistance of playing wingers on their opposite sides) to play down that left flank. Rodallega whilst good enough to operate as part of a 2 man forward line isn’t (& never will be!!) a left winger
On top of that the creative hub of the side purchased by Bobby (Gomez) was not (& never will be) good enough for the English top flight
So what Bobby wound up doing was playing several square pegs in several round holes
& that is why it didn’t work – coz he didn;t have the personnel to play itLikewise, 4-4-2 failed for England not because the system doesn’t work but because Capello picked his squad based on who he thought were his best 23 players regardless of whether that gave him enough specialist cover in all 11 positions.
As a result we wound up with central midfielders playing on the left wing, central midfielders playing on the right wing & no left wingers in the entire squad
He also took players who were unfit – Barry & Lennon & players who aren’t good enough (Heskey, Carragher & Upson)
Add all to that petulant players who didn’t like the conditions & positions they were put in to & that’s why England flopped. Its not because they played 4-4-2
IMO he would have been better playing 4-5-1 coz when you looked at the squad that was the formation best suited to the players he’d taken with himHopefully Bobby spends this close season siging players who fit the system & then it will hopefully be a success btu it won;t be because 4-5-1 is the best system to play regardless of who you have playing in it but because he’s bought players suited to that system. Last season he didn’t have those players
Rant over
Good rant Tyldesley, and I can’t disagree with anything you say, well, apart from the bit about all of the Dark Side sharing your rational views.
LMB and yourself are leading member of the anti-Martinez brigade, but you can both put a valid argument forward. There were numerous others of your persuasion however who could not, and who are probably just dummy-spitters.
My post is aimed that those who ask:
‘What’s the point of playing a left footer on the right?’ and ‘Who plays this system successfully?’I would also like to point out that I hope to become a fully paid up member of the pro-Martinez brigade next season as his new signings, current squad & playing system combine to provide poetry in motion
Based on what I saw of Bobby’s tactics, substiutions, stubborn streak, comments to the press (& the Latics websites) and to some extent (some of) his signings last season, I can’t see that happening but I really hope I’m proved wrong
I would also like to point out that I hope to become a fully paid up member of the pro-Martinez brigade next season as his new signings, current squad & playing system combine to provide poetry in motionBased on what I saw of Bobby’s tactics, substiutions, stubborn streak, comments to the press (& the Latics websites) and to some extent (some of) his signings last season, I can’t see that happening but I really hope I’m proved wrong
Do I detect a hint of positivity there Tyldesley? ;)
And in the nicest possible way I hope you are proved wrong ;)
as i too am a member of the darkside,boselli looks good on utube but will he make it in the prem
i hope he does and i hope bob gets it right this season.On top of that, we didn’t have anyone (with Bobby’s insistance of playing wingers on their opposite sides) to play down that left flank. Rodallega whilst good enough to operate as part of a 2 man forward line isn’t (& never will be!!) a left wingerDirk Kuyt* and Niclas Anelka (to pluck just two out) are not wingers either but they play in this ‘wide’ role, sometimes on their weaker side in system similar to Wigan’s with some success.
I agree that Wigan had square pegs in some round holes last season. I am not convinced that going 442 or any other system would have yielded any better results and as we didn’t do it that often and for any sustained period of time, no one can prove me wrong – or right!
Bobby’s target was to get his players to play the new way and survive. Objective b) achievced, jury still out on Objective a). He has said hewe will now kick on – let’s hope he’s right.
For me Alcaraz and Boselli have the potential to improve the first team significantly. We still have a gaping hole of creativity in the middle of the park that needs filling before the end of August.
* On the way back from Leeds on Monday afternoon I listened to Bobby Gould repeatedly refer to Kurt as “Dick Kuyt”. This was bugging me until he got it spectacularly wrong and called him – and I kid you not – Dick van Dyke.
I can’t disagree with anything you said Tyldesley, now that Martinez has got in mind the system he wants us to use, he can look at and purchase players that are suited to utilise it. Last season he was trying to turn a predominantly 4-4-2 side into a 4-5-1 side, and sadly some of the players struggled to adapt, with a few just simply not being good enough at all for the top flight (Gomez & Scotland).
We still need to get a left winger if he’ll remain insistent on playing N’Zogbia on the right.
- You must be logged in to reply to this topic.
