› Forums › Latics Crazy Forum › 60% of the possession. 30% of the shots
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22 January 2012 at 1:41 pm #79039
according to sky sports stats.
That says it all about Bobby’s “brand” of football22 January 2012 at 3:49 pm #79061I’ll add my twopennyworth of one cause of the problem – and that’s stats.
Now I know Bobby isn’t the only one who uses them, Bruce was quite a believer. But stats should be used as indicators, not the be-all and end-all.
Bobby constantly talks of squad players (ie those not getting a game) by quoting that their performance is not yet at the right levels, their fitness isn’t ready etc. As they aren’t playing he is clearly only getting this information from figures from training. Which is OK to a point. But stats don’t show someone in training who may not be performing at the highest levels (because he just can’t) but is so eager to prove himself, who wants more than anything to wear the shirt, who would die to be on the pitch. I’m not saying that there are people like that, but maybe to some extent: PVA was so p***ed off because he wasn’t getting a game. He wanted to play and may well have done far better than those who did.
Then on matchday we have figures upon figures and analysis upon analysis. And I think he is placing a lot of decisions on that information. One is clearly “passes completed”, and that instils in the players a fear of making a misplaced pass, so they take the easy option and pass sideways and back. It doesn’t matter on the stats that there may have been more risky but potentially more probing options available. If you pass to a blue shirt then that’s a tick in the box for you.
You don’t hear Ferguson talking about pass completion rate, or fitness levels. And United play the unexpected long ball, cross field, or run at the defender.
The analogy is a call centre. They have masses and masses and masses of individual performance figures. One is call handling time. Get as many calls as you can, what is the average call handling time, and if you are quicker than the target time you get a tick in the performance box. It doesn’t matter how briefly you cut the caller off, it doesn’t matter if you didn’t actually resolve their query – the stats are all important.
The big mistake, in my humble opinion, is not that the tactics (as in 4-4-2/4-5-1 or whatever) are wrong, or that the players are second rate (individually and with other clubs they have been fine), it’s that the stats regime limits them in what they can do without having a big cross put in the box instead of a tick.
Stats should be used as an information tool, but then the manager (of a football team or of a call centre) has to use his skill and experience to identify what is really going on and make managerial decisions accordingly. Unfortunately (and I hate to say this) this is where Bobby’s inexperience has shown through – he’s read the manual, done the course or whatever – but what is needed is a sensible head with experience of occesionally throwing the book out, and going with a gut instinct.
22 January 2012 at 4:01 pm #79065and the above comes from a coaching team who aren’t aways UEFA Pro-Licence qualified. Roberto talks of 8 times to watch a game and find answers. I’ll give him the answer we are a bunch of bottlers who don’t work hard enough when they are on the pitch and that comes down to training methods. I remember some guy on that last meeting with the website editors getting a bit of ridicule about his question of ‘auditing trainiing methods’ well I don’t think he actually got the question right but he was probably alluding to this way of thinking.
You have to earn the right to play good football and we don’t.
23 January 2012 at 12:33 am #79122I’ll add my twopennyworth of one cause of the problem – and that’s stats.Now I know Bobby isn’t the only one who uses them, Bruce was quite a believer. But stats should be used as indicators, not the be-all and end-all.
Bobby constantly talks of squad players (ie those not getting a game) by quoting that their performance is not yet at the right levels, their fitness isn’t ready etc. As they aren’t playing he is clearly only getting this information from figures from training. Which is OK to a point. But stats don’t show someone in training who may not be performing at the highest levels (because he just can’t) but is so eager to prove himself, who wants more than anything to wear the shirt, who would die to be on the pitch. I’m not saying that there are people like that, but maybe to some extent: PVA was so p***ed off because he wasn’t getting a game. He wanted to play and may well have done far better than those who did.
Then on matchday we have figures upon figures and analysis upon analysis. And I think he is placing a lot of decisions on that information. One is clearly “passes completed”, and that instils in the players a fear of making a misplaced pass, so they take the easy option and pass sideways and back. It doesn’t matter on the stats that there may have been more risky but potentially more probing options available. If you pass to a blue shirt then that’s a tick in the box for you.
You don’t hear Ferguson talking about pass completion rate, or fitness levels. And United play the unexpected long ball, cross field, or run at the defender.
The analogy is a call centre. They have masses and masses and masses of individual performance figures. One is call handling time. Get as many calls as you can, what is the average call handling time, and if you are quicker than the target time you get a tick in the performance box. It doesn’t matter how briefly you cut the caller off, it doesn’t matter if you didn’t actually resolve their query – the stats are all important.
The big mistake, in my humble opinion, is not that the tactics (as in 4-4-2/4-5-1 or whatever) are wrong, or that the players are second rate (individually and with other clubs they have been fine), it’s that the stats regime limits them in what they can do without having a big cross put in the box instead of a tick.
Stats should be used as an information tool, but then the manager (of a football team or of a call centre) has to use his skill and experience to identify what is really going on and make managerial decisions accordingly. Unfortunately (and I hate to say this) this is where Bobby’s inexperience has shown through – he’s read the manual, done the course or whatever – but what is needed is a sensible head with experience of occesionally throwing the book out, and going with a gut instinct.
I think you speak a lot of truth there G.
23 January 2012 at 2:41 am #79155good post.
23 January 2012 at 12:35 pm #79189I’ll add my twopennyworth of one cause of the problem – and that’s stats.The analogy is a call centre. They have masses and masses and masses of individual performance figures. One is call handling time. Get as many calls as you can, what is the average call handling time, and if you are quicker than the target time you get a tick in the performance box. It doesn’t matter how briefly you cut the caller off, it doesn’t matter if you didn’t actually resolve their query – the stats are all important.
George, i completely agree with the analogy – lies, damm lies, & statistics and all that BUT my Mrs (who you know from Griffin House) won some gift vouchers for being one of the ‘top performers’ on her section last month (in what is now basically just a call centre);
it’s a braver man than me who would dare to suggest to her that she is doing anything other than a good job :(23 January 2012 at 1:57 pm #79200Far be it from me to suggest otherwise, Andy. I was talking in the generality of course, not specifics ;)
23 January 2012 at 2:13 pm #79201(who you know from Griffin House) :(That sounds very grand. Has he won the lottery over the weekend or something?
23 January 2012 at 3:37 pm #79206Did you not know he’s had a large retinue of staff for years?
23 January 2012 at 3:39 pm #79208I can believe that. He does look that sort.
23 January 2012 at 4:46 pm #79218(who you know from Griffin House) :(
That sounds very grand. Has he won the lottery over the weekend or something?[/quote]
There isn’t a lot goes on this town that isn’t all about me, to be fair.
24 January 2012 at 12:28 am #79267Then there is the Griffin public house that has some pretty good bands on !!
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› Forums › Latics Crazy Forum › 60% of the possession. 30% of the shots