same old bull,

The word you are looking for is ‘hispanic’, but in all honesty, what relevance does someone’s ethnic origin have to whether you think they can manage a football team or not?

I accept that a lot of our supporters do not like what Martinez is doing, but why prefixed an insult with ‘Spanish’ or ‘Hispanic’ as has happed often on this board.

Martinez got himself a degree in his spare time whilst playing professional football, is articulate, and fluent in two languages. He may quite rightly consider many of those booing and hurling abuse at him to be insular, uneducated Wiganners.

We struggle to attract players to Wigan, and is it any wonder why? Recently we’ve had threads where supporters have reported how they have been proud that they’ve shouted ‘Get back to your corner shop’, made Semitic remarks at Spurs fans, and have called our own manager a ‘Spic’. Last season we had a couple of instances of the old ‘You’re just a town full of P@ckis’ song being sung.

Maybe at the next home game we can get a singsong of ‘We’re just a town full of thickos’ going.

They aren’t offensive posts as such Landgate, just a case of some of our finest knuckle-draggers displaying their small world mentalities.

Using the term ‘Spanish’ and making a point about his nationality in relationship to Martinez was probably first used by myself, I was accused of being racist by someone on here for saying it, but I assure you it was never meant that way, and for that reason I stated, again on here, I would not use it again,
I did it in the first place because every manager of Spanish origin who has come into English football has been an unmitigated disaster, and I include that clown at Liverpool in that, I honestly believe that this will also prove the case with Martinez, so “someone’s ethnic origin” does have a bearing and relevance in this instance, again that is my opinion.

I don’t doubt or argue for one minute that Martinez is not an articulate, bright, well educated, multi-lingual young man, but some on here rightfully question his football ability and I would add that Brian Clough, Bob Paisley or Bill Shankley didn’t have any formal education to speak off, in fact Shankley was only semi literate, even our own multi millionaire owner has no language skills or a degree, and has not done so bad in life, so to argue that because Martinez has those things it leads to football awareness is a little wide of the mark.

I also dispute two other points you make, Martinez has got off lightly so far, yes the team and him have been booed but the abuse has never been personal as you suggest, look at what Megson endured up at Horwich, Martinez as you say is quite a clever bloke and he has been in football long enough to know how fickle a lot we fans are and the stick any manager gets is part and parcel of the job.
Martinez has not got half the stick he would have done had he not served us well in the past.
You also infer that this booing and name calling in the ground and on message boards is why “We struggle to attract players to Wigan” that is outrageous, there are a number of reasons but that is certainly not one of them.

One thing we do agree about and I touched on it earlier, both on here and in the ground racism is the haven of the uneducated and should never be tollerated.

“bruce did nothing for us from xmas onwards”

To be fair to Bruce, he took us to a position where we were challenging for European qualification & then had some of his best players sold out from underneath him despit him publicly saying they would be “mad” to do so just weeks earlier.

The statements from our chairman that we were now safe & had to build for next season demoralised the manager, showed the players it was “job done” time & (as in our 1st season in the top flight) results suffered. There was also Cattermole’s injury which kept him out for a while & Valencia (understandably) not wanting to pick up a serious injury & ruin his chance of a move to United pulling out of games left right & centre. Bruce went from looking to keep the squad together & bring in & ship out in the summer to having some of his most important squad members sold & having to get replacement in to hit the ground running in a coupe of weeks.

Martinez had 1 player sold out from under him (Cattermole) & has had 2 full transfer windows to bring in his players. He was able to keep his squad together in January & he’s had 9 months to get the team playing “his way” yet our defensive problems only just seem to be lifting & going forward things seem to be getting worse by the week

Just to add as well to the “Bruce did nothing from Xmas onwards” – latics played 21 games after Xmas last season & our record was:

W-6, D-5, L-10, F-13, A-23, PTS-23. Averaged over the course of a season that’s give us 41 points & safety

Our record from the last 21 games of this season is:

W-4, D-7, L-10, F-22, A-41, PTS-19. Averaged over the course of a full season that’s give us 34 points & possible relegation

However little the poster felt Bruce did after Xmas, it was more than Bobby has been doing

Loudmouth

The post wasn’t aimed at you, as I know you used the term ‘Spanish One’ at the start of the season, and after that it became a bit of a running joke, certainly with no malice was intended.

Yes, I agree that there is a Spanish style, however it doesn’t mean that if you’re Spanish, you will play that way – especially considering Martinez spent most of his playing career in the UK. It’s like saying that all Italian managers will play negative football, when someone like Zola clearly does not.

Also, I was only illustrating that Martinez is an intelligent man not as proof that it guarantees he will be a good manager, but in response to some of the posts accusing him of being a moron or not having enough intelligence to be a success (Mighty Aff made this particular remark I think). The man is bright, but it’s more stubbornness and self-belief, not a lack of brain calls that is stopping him winning games.

I’d disagree that Martinez does not get personal abuse. During the Notts County game at the DW, I was sitting in WS6, and had two idiots standing up behind me calling him a ‘Spanish c***’ and telling him to ‘Fook off back to Spain’. With such a low crowd, and with these halfwits being so close to him, he must have heard some of the comments. My season ticket is in WS7, and even in this usually sleepy backwater, there are insults aimed at him during every home game. Perhaps it isn’t as bad in the East Stand, but some of the things I’ve heard recently have been cringeworthy, not to the Megson level yet, but it certainly isn’t just a general boo of disappointment.

At no point have I inferred that the booing and name calling alone will prevent players joining Wigan, but it will become a contributing factor. Realistically, Wigan as a Premier League club has not had much to offer players in the past other than to serve as a stepping stone playing in front of a small but appreciative fanbase. Now a proportion of that supporters’ appreciation has gone, and players will liable to have people watching them who boo them and will possibly hurl racist or xenophobic insults at them. Would you want to play in front of that?

Whichever side of the Martinez fence you sit on, you have to agree that we have more than our fair share of mindless idiots who do nothing to dispel the image of the insular grubby little backwater that a number of the press paint Wigan to be.

Its not results is it, its the lack of passion shown by th eplayers and the decisions made by the manager that is killing us off.

I do not mind losing as long as the players try hard, the football master martinez has them playing is not good enough, simple as that.