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Firstly, may I say this post is NOT a knee jerk reaction after last night. But reading a few posts on here today, I thought I’d start a debate as to how we think we are progressing under Martinez.
People keep saying we are making progress, but yet I was staggered at how poor our fringe players performed last night, suggesting our squad is weak and if we have any injuries or suspensions, we don’t have any reliable quality to call upon.
People say we have progressed…..but how? I don’t see it. I looked at a programme from 07/08 today, when Bruce was in charge, and we were no better off points wise at this same stage as the season. So points wise, no better off, squad wise we are certainly no better off. We don’t have a reserve team, we have this ‘development squad’ nonsense……
…come on, explain how we are better off? Because we are what, 3, or is it 4, I forget, seasons into Martinez’s reign, and how are we better off? I don’t see as we are, in all honesty.
Now lads (and lasses), no falling out. Let’s just debate it, thanks.
Firstly, may I say this post is NOT a knee jerk reaction after last night. But reading a few posts on here today, I thought I’d start a debate as to how we think we are progressing under Martinez.People keep saying we are making progress, but yet I was staggered at how poor our fringe players performed last night, suggesting our squad is weak and if we have any injuries or suspensions, we don’t have any reliable quality to call upon.
People say we have progressed…..but how? I don’t see it. I looked at a programme from 07/08 today, when Bruce was in charge, and we were no better off points wise at this same stage as the season. So points wise, no better off, squad wise we are certainly no better off. We don’t have a reserve team, we have this ‘development squad’ nonsense……
…come on, explain how we are better off? Because we are what, 3, or is it 4, I forget, seasons into Martinez’s reign, and how are we better off? I don’t see as we are, in all honesty.
Now lads (and lasses), no falling out. Let’s just debate it, thanks.
OK ABL; i’ll have a go at this.
If you are going to compare our squad and achievements today to when Bruce was in charge. You have to also consider the restraints that Roberto is working under at moment. Bruce however had free reign in comparison. Hence Bruce leaving us when he was asked to cut the wage bill and reduce scouting network. Roberto has maintained premierleague status and also achieved wins against Liverpool,Chelsea,Arsenal and more importantly Manchester United whilst working wwith the aforementioned restraints. Roberto has systematically removed or rid contracts of extortionate salaries.
It doesnt take a genius to see that i am of course pro-Martinez.
I feel if we had martinez when Mr Whelan was spending on transfers and allowing large contractual salaries for players – we would be better off. however that is not the case yet we are still able to maintain premierleague status. not too bad of an achievement in my eyes.
you say people have said we are making progress? im not sure who you are referring to. However i possibly see progress differently to yourself.
I also feel we didnt play particulary poor last night. we dominated a team that offered nothing apart from a defensive wall of 10 players in their own third. When chelsea did that in the champions league they beat barca. I dont think things are as bad as some fans make out.
we also have some decent young players coming through. something that we can not say has happened before (Baines exception of course)
Well after many months of championing Boselli the lad seems to be making me look like I have no idea what I am talking about ( Please refrain from the obvious riposte ! )Well the player in question is our record signing brought in by Mr Martinez and so the question is does the boss know his onions ? Had he been given that free financial reign, how many other duffers would he have squandered Uncle Dave’s money on ?
thats a fair comment, but when you look at diame, Ramis how Di Santo has come on as a player. McCarthy and McArthur who were bought at budget price. I think there are more positives than negatives.
when i mentioned the finance issue – i was really referring to the fact Bruce et al had at their disposal weekly wages of upto £40k to entice players. Martinez is playing about with £10k week. that is a big obstacle to over come. I think he is doing a grand job.
I have grown to like RM but every now and again his obstinacy gets the better of him. His other fault in my opinion is his obsession with possession stats ! I think the form on the whole since he took over has been capricious and enigmatic which can lead to plenty of head scratching at times yet pure ecstasy at others ! I keep going back for more though !
For the benefit of certain super fans on here, I tend not to travel away very often though !Well after many months of championing Boselli the lad seems to be making me look like I have no idea what I am talking about ( Please refrain from the obvious riposte ! )Well the player in question is our record signing brought in by Mr Martinez and so the question is does the boss know his onions ? Had he been given that free financial reign, how many other duffers would he have squandered Uncle Dave’s money on ?Has had the odd blip in the transfer market, hopefully his recent acquisitions will shape up (Kone, a steal, off to a flyer…).
Has provided for stability at the club with Uncle Dave’s significant backing. In so doing, overseen transformation of the playing staff / style of play, to one more cost effective and easy on the eye.
Undoubtedly, he has made mistakes (who hasn’t ?), but has matured as a manager and got his team, back end of last season, to turn on ‘Barca-like’ performances against the big guns, that had the New York Times (or something similar)drooling about Wigan Athletic (who?).
Having worked on the foundations over several seasons and given us an inkling of what can be achieved (latter 2011/12), a positive campaign this year (Top 12)will further enhance his reputation.
Firstly, may I say this post is NOT a knee jerk reaction after last night. But reading a few posts on here today, I thought I’d start a debate as to how we think we are progressing under Martinez.People keep saying we are making progress, but yet I was staggered at how poor our fringe players performed last night, suggesting our squad is weak and if we have any injuries or suspensions, we don’t have any reliable quality to call upon.
People say we have progressed…..but how? I don’t see it. I looked at a programme from 07/08 today, when Bruce was in charge, and we were no better off points wise at this same stage as the season. So points wise, no better off, squad wise we are certainly no better off. We don’t have a reserve team, we have this ‘development squad’ nonsense……
…come on, explain how we are better off? Because we are what, 3, or is it 4, I forget, seasons into Martinez’s reign, and how are we better off? I don’t see as we are, in all honesty.
Now lads (and lasses), no falling out. Let’s just debate it, thanks.
No need for us to fall out Dave, you will do that with yourself if your not careful, try to hold yourself together and think before you type.
Have a look at our achievements last year, not the 8 game losing run but how many points we accumulated and the position we finished in the league. I make it 7 points clear of relegation with an 11 goal better GD than 3rd from bottom Noblot. Add into the mix the fact we took our first ever points off the mighty Man U, beat Arsenal on their own midding and Liverpool on their own precious Anfield.
Have we progressed……er yes I would say we have. During the close season we have managed to hold on to Bobby and he has managed to hold on to the nucleus of last seasons better performing team. Diame and Rodders didn’t feature much in that good run only Victor has escaped the friendly, warm family home that is Wigan Athletic.
This season has been a bit frustrating as our general play has deserved more than the 8 points we have bagged, nobody can deny that. We are definitely looking an all round better team, with Franco and kone causing any defence problems and the James boys winning more midfield battles than they lose.
Yes, I say we have and are still progressing under Martinez. Lets see what this season brings and not get our knickers in a twist over last nights cup exit. Has some posters have already said, we didn’t actually play that bad last night, we just didn’t finish. That’s football for you, if that header from Ramis hadn’t been ruled out, Bradford would have had to come out of their penalty box and I’m sure it would have been 5 or 6.
Take a chill pill and get yourself psyched up for a thrilling game at WHL. B)
From Matlock to ManU
What a journey!I for one think the club have made progress but mainly behind the scenes. We had to get our house in order as the debt we had / have is eye watering…
I’d guess most Wigan fans want Bob to do well, and he could if he was a tad more positive. Even with the bargain basement buys he’s made they can play some good stuff. If he sticks with a 4-4-3 formation and plays to our strengths then we’ll comfortably be a mid table side.
So the potential is there, it’s just down to Bob to make it happenid love him to stick to a 4-4-3 – as i think it gives a major advantage over other teams. :dry: :ohmy:
id love him to stick to a 4-4-3 – as i think it gives a major advantage over other teams. :dry: :ohmy: Not if the extra one is
id love him to stick to a 4-4-3 – as i think it gives a major advantage over other teams. :dry: :ohmy: Glad it’s not just me then – I’ve been scrathing my head all morning over this one.
People keep saying we are making progress, but yet I was staggered at how poor our fringe players performed last night, suggesting our squad is weak and if we have any injuries or suspensions, we don’t have any reliable quality to call upon.I would say the fact we are able to field a squad mostly made up of “fringe players” is major progress in itself.
Under Jewell we failed to fill the bench in the PL a couple of times.
And under Bruce these crap fringe players who are not good enough would be playing in the first team i.e Kapo, De Ridder and Chon Dong whatever.
People say we have progressed…..but how? I don’t see it. I looked at a programme from 07/08 today, when Bruce was in charge, and we were no better off points wise at this same stage as the season. So points wise, no better off, squad wise we are certainly no better off. We don’t have a reserve team, we have this ‘development squad’ nonsense……Go on type up the squad off your program I bet the likes of Kone, McCarthy, McCarthur, Caldwell, and Al Habsi put that squad to shame on paper.
…come on, explain how we are better off? Because we are what, 3, or is it 4, I forget, seasons into Martinez’s reign, and how are we better off? I don’t see as we are, in all honesty.1. We no longer roll over for the top 4 teams thus making a total of 24 points a season now a difficult but not impossible prospect.
2. As said in a previous point we now at least have a reserve, fringe, development squad instead of a squad half full of youngsters and half bruces seriously poor signings.
3. Every year we have stayed in the premiership under Martinez’s guidance has left us with a £60 million plus injection into the club which will only serve to increase the long term health of Wigan Athletic.
4. We now have a manager who actually cares about this club. If he left us at the end of the season we would be in a miles better position than the last 2 times Bruce had used us as a stepping stone and that my friend is a fact.
I personally think we have gone as far as we are going to go. We are always going to be struggling in the top flight and will always lose more than we win. Now if we continue to cause the odd upset then that will balance up the odd debacle and so therefore we keep watching ! We will always have to sell our best players and will always have to look for bargain buys just to survive in the Prem. It’s a pity RM’s domestic cup philosophy is what it is because a good cup run is always good for morale and that is what is needed at WAFC in my opinion. If we don’t get the odd upper like that then we have to be content with pretty much the same year in year out ! Win 1 draw 1 lose 3 with the odd upset thrown in now and again we obtain survival….Just ! That is the way it will always be I’m afraid !
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