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what a clever little boy you are do you want a job with my company lol
Too busy running my own sudders, and I couldn’t be arsed cleaning up empty cans and sandwich crusts off the floor of a shitty old coach, and less of the ‘little’ , you obviously don’t know me, though I know you, I’d say you’re middle aged, short, stocky (fat), and your fingers on your right hand are orange and smell of maggots. It’s like being on a forum with derren brown eh sudders?
If it wasn’t for the signing of the Duke, god knows what league we’d be in today. His signing was a bit of a turning point for the club in my opinion.
Very sad how that player’s career went down the pan.
Well done to his agent, Tony Finnigan, for really making the most of his players career….not.
Him and Roberts in the Premiership….it could’ve been beautiful. :(
Indeed!
Word at the time was he was in Whelan’s office saying he didn’t really want to go and that he accepted a contract at West Brom than was less than we was offering….
Really earned his agent fee on that one the ****.[/quote]
Blaming his agent is an absolute cop out in my opinion
Only 1 person had the ultimate say in whether he stayed at Latics or moved & that was Nathan Ellington himself – he’s an adult human male & if he didn’t want to go he could have quite simply said no he wanted to stay at Latics & sign the deal that they put on the table for him.
It’s not like Tony Finnigan held a gun to his head or anythingFrom what I can gather, the issue was that the total package on offer at Latics had the potential to be more than the total package on offer at West Brom but Ellington wanted a bigger basic salary which was what West Brom were offering. Whilst Latics package was heavily weighted towards appearance & performance related bonuses.
Not knocking him for taking what West Brom offered & if his performances in the top flight were anything to go by then he’d have been on next to nowt at Latics ;) but Nathan Ellington alone decided to move, Tony Finnigan merely got him the best deal out there which is what footballers pay them to doVery sad how that player’s career went down the pan.
Well done to his agent, Tony Finnigan, for really making the most of his players career….not.
Him and Roberts in the Premiership….it could’ve been beautiful. :(
Indeed!
Word at the time was he was in Whelan’s office saying he didn’t really want to go and that he accepted a contract at West Brom than was less than we was offering….
Really earned his agent fee on that one the ****.[/quote]
Blaming his agent is an absolute cop out in my opinion
Only 1 person had the ultimate say in whether he stayed at Latics or moved & that was Nathan Ellington himself – he’s an adult human male & if he didn’t want to go he could have quite simply said no he wanted to stay at Latics & sign the deal that they put on the table for him.
It’s not like Tony Finnigan held a gun to his head or anythingFrom what I can gather, the issue was that the total package on offer at Latics had the potential to be more than the total package on offer at West Brom but Ellington wanted a bigger basic salary which was what West Brom were offering. Whilst Latics package was heavily weighted towards appearance & performance related bonuses.
Not knocking him for taking what West Brom offered & if his performances in the top flight were anything to go by then he’d have been on next to nowt at Latics ;) but Nathan Ellington alone decided to move, Tony Finnigan merely got him the best deal out there which is what footballers pay them to do[/quote]Tony Finnigans relative? :P
Very sad how that player’s career went down the pan.
Well done to his agent, Tony Finnigan, for really making the most of his players career….not.
Him and Roberts in the Premiership….it could’ve been beautiful. :(
Indeed!
Word at the time was he was in Whelan’s office saying he didn’t really want to go and that he accepted a contract at West Brom than was less than we was offering….
Really earned his agent fee on that one the ****.[/quote]
Blaming his agent is an absolute cop out in my opinion
Only 1 person had the ultimate say in whether he stayed at Latics or moved & that was Nathan Ellington himself – he’s an adult human male & if he didn’t want to go he could have quite simply said no he wanted to stay at Latics & sign the deal that they put on the table for him.
It’s not like Tony Finnigan held a gun to his head or anythingFrom what I can gather, the issue was that the total package on offer at Latics had the potential to be more than the total package on offer at West Brom but Ellington wanted a bigger basic salary which was what West Brom were offering. Whilst Latics package was heavily weighted towards appearance & performance related bonuses.
Not knocking him for taking what West Brom offered & if his performances in the top flight were anything to go by then he’d have been on next to nowt at Latics ;) but Nathan Ellington alone decided to move, Tony Finnigan merely got him the best deal out there which is what footballers pay them to do[/quote]I agree that the final say would of been down to Ellington but I don’t think that makes Finnigan an innocent party in it all.
What about the £3million release clause that seemed to pop out of thin air at the time only to appear in every news paper with an opinion on the subject ?
I know who my bets on for releasing that little chestnut of information.
Finnigan sees this club as a stepping stone for his players.
He stirs the s**t up royal with players as recent as Moses and then sits back content in the knowledge we wont sell for anything other than a decent price massively marked up on what we paid and handing him a bigger slice of pie to take home.
I have absolutely no doubt that it was Tony Finnigan who leaked information to the press about Ellington’s £3mill “release clause” – whether that was with the okay of Ellington or not is open to debate but even if it wasn’t then it makes no difference. All it did was alert club’s into knowing what they’d have to pay to get him. Once they’d bid that amount, Ellington could still have said he didn’t want to talk to them & Ellington could still have said no to any deal subsequently put on the table.
Footballers pay him to get them the best deal out there & that is what he did for Ellington – he didn’t force him to leave & he didn’t threaten him so that he didn’t sign Latics deal.
No matter how much stirring any agent does only the player can decide to move – the blame for what happened to Ellington’s career post-Latics is Nathan Ellington’s fault & no-one elses.
Same with Moses – no doubt Finnigan told him that club’s were already offering him more than Latics were putting on the table & exactly who those club’s were, but beyond that the decision to push for a move was Moses’s. Whether that was the right move (& the early signs are that he is doing far better than i thought he would be there) only time will tell.
At the end of the day, Finnigan’s job is to look after his players & not Wigan Athletic. You can hardly blame him for using Latics as a stepping stone for his players when that is exactly how the club sells itself in the first placeI disagree that Ellington was master of his own destiny because that’s what mature, worldly-wise, confident men are, and unfortunately that exactly what Ellington wasn’t.
Young footballers have usually never had another job other than being a footballer. They’ve never done anything for themselves and have gone from their mothers looking after them to a player liaison officer and an agent.
They are told what, where, and how often to do things, and trust their agents’ judgement implicitly. They even have ‘lifestyle management’ companies who change their lightbulbs at home or arrange for their cars to be valeted.
It’s only when they mature some and in a lot of cases, get married and have kids that they suddenly start questioning what people are trying to do for them.
Obviously there are exceptions to the rule, but there are an awful lot of young players around who would paint their bollocks blue and stand in John Menzies window if their agents told them to do it.
Moses is another who falls into this bracket – prompting Whelan’s quip of ‘If he had half a brain he’d stay under Roberto for another season’.
I don’t doubt that Ellington trusted his agent to advise him as to the best course of action as everyone relies on somebody to guide them but you don’t have to do what they say – as a 17 year old who had no independence other than the money I got flogging programmes outside Springfield Park & a previous job delivering the Leigh Journal who relied on his parents for everything (food, shelter, clothing etc..), applying for University my parents were telling me to apply for law at Manchester & the reasons why I should but I wanted to do history at Aberystwyth, so I did despite the fact I trusted my parents judgement implicitly.
As a 20+ yr old man who had the independence to decide to convert to Islam & get married the day before a game without informing his employers, don’t tell me that Ellington didn’t have the balls, independence or intelligence to say no to what WBA put on the table.
Same with Moses – again no doubt his agent was waving a big fat contract under his nose & telling him how many other clubs were after him too & how much extra he could get with deals as a Nigerian international at Chelsea & that he was good enough to be playing regularly for them, but he could have said no. Whelan’s quip was I believe telling him to look at it rationally & just question whether he’d develop more playing for Latics every week or in the stiff’s/sub appearances he’d get at Chelsea & then in 12 months time he’d be able to command an even better deal. He could have ignored his agent’s advice – he chose not to & any repercussions (good or bad) from that decision lie with Moses & no-one else
Never trusted that Judy Finnigan either after she got her jubbles out on TV.Am i the only one who got strangely aroused by that?? :woohoo: :woohoo:
I don’t doubt that Ellington trusted his agent to advise him as to the best course of action as everyone relies on somebody to guide them but you don’t have to do what they say – as a 17 year old who had no independence other than the money I got flogging programmes outside Springfield Park & a previous job delivering the Leigh Journal who relied on his parents for everything (food, shelter, clothing etc..), applying for University my parents were telling me to apply for law at Manchester & the reasons why I should but I wanted to do history at Aberystwyth, so I did despite the fact I trusted my parents judgement implicitly.As a 20+ yr old man who had the independence to decide to convert to Islam & get married the day before a game without informing his employers, don’t tell me that Ellington didn’t have the balls, independence or intelligence to say no to what WBA put on the table.
Same with Moses – again no doubt his agent was waving a big fat contract under his nose & telling him how many other clubs were after him too & how much extra he could get with deals as a Nigerian international at Chelsea & that he was good enough to be playing regularly for them, but he could have said no. Whelan’s quip was I believe telling him to look at it rationally & just question whether he’d develop more playing for Latics every week or in the stiff’s/sub appearances he’d get at Chelsea & then in 12 months time he’d be able to command an even better deal. He could have ignored his agent’s advice – he chose not to & any repercussions (good or bad) from that decision lie with Moses & no-one else
It’s exactly what I’m telling you, and you’ve just reinforced it:
‘As a 20+ yr old man who had the independence to decide to convert to Islam & get married the day before a game without informing his employers’
He married a Muslim girl and HE converted to Islam. It’s hardly a show of independence – more a demonstration of him acceding to the wishes of his wife to be and her family. He also didn’t have the gumption or bottle to tell the club that what he was doing the day before a game, which is not really an indicator of intelligence.
By all accounts his agent who was the only person he didn’t want to disappoint. Even his wife didn’t want to move.
Yes, I know exactly what Whelan’s comments regarding Moses implied ie. telling him to look rationally at it, but the very phrase ‘if he had half a brain’ is a clear indication that Whelan thought he was not thinking for himself or had the ability to think rationally.
From reports, Moses rarely utters a word, so the last thing he’s going to do is speak up again someone he trusts as his advisor.
You’re basing your opinion on what you were like as a young lad, but you need to take into account that they aren’t as educated as you or have ever had a need to think for themselves.
Yes, they do have the opportunity to say no to their agents, but many of them won’t because their agent has been their surrogate mother since they were in their teens, and their agent is the person they perceive to know best and the one who will make the right decisions for them.
“He married a Muslim girl and HE converted to Islam. It’s hardly a show of independence – more a demonstration of him acceding to the wishes of his wife to be and her family. He also didn’t have the gumption or bottle to tell the club that what he was doing the day before a game, which is not really an indicator of intelligence”
It’s no more a demonstartion that he acceded to the wishes of his wife & her family than it’s demonstration that he felt passionately about Islam & happened to fall in love with someone also of that faith.
Likewise with the date of the marriage it could also be an indication that he had the strength of character to think that it’s got feck all to do with them (which ultimately it hasn’t), I won’t be drinking & I won’t be out beyond my pre-match curfew so I won’t tell them as the only reason it will be an issue is coz of the religion it involves.“Yes, they do have the opportunity to say no to their agents, but many of them won’t” – that just shows that essentially we’re in agreement. They can say no in instances like this but they choose not to (or these 2 did anyway). I’ve no doubt that I (& millions of other people) have made decisions based on advice we received from people we trusted implicitly that turned out to be b0ll0x but at the end of the day no matter who that advice was from & how qualified they were to give it we could still have said no so the blame for owt that goes wrong lies with us
We’ll have to agree to disagree on that first bit, because in my opinion if he felt passionately about Islam he’d have converted prior to meeting his wife, not after meeting and with a view to marriage.
Likewise I’d say a full day of marriage celebrations – alcohol present or no alcohol present – is hardly the ideal preparation for a professional footballer and anyone with a semblance of intelligence would know not to plan a wedding the day before you play football.
Yes players always have the opportunity to say no, but many of them won’t because they trust what their agent says. So although Ellington was allegedly in tears when he left Wigan and probably with a feeling that it was not the best move, his agent had got him the move to Wigan in the first place and he trusted him again to make the right decision.
In my opinion you can only blame a player like Ellington insomuch as he put his full trust in a man who was looking for the short term financial rewards, not long term future development and the higher financial rewards that would have come with that.
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