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I assume the only way Sammon would of been given offside would be if the ball rebounded off the post and he slotted the ball in the back of the net
Yes i understand why you come to that conclusion, but if you look from behind the goals or indeed from robinsons own position, sammon is to robinsons right and gomez and the balls path to his left and i would say he is more unsighted from his own players than being impeded in any way from sammon.
In defence of the referee his view of it, from where i assume he was positioned, would be the mirror image and he would only see sammon out to robinsons left and not interfering – although I doubt it never came into question because the linesman never lifted a flag, and from his point of view at the side, he would only see sammon moving away from the goal.This is another decision that probably can only be confirmed by TV replay and keane would have no grounds at the time, other than it going against, him to legitimately claim it was offside.
The website I looked at it on showed the side on view where it looks nailed on that Sammon is blocking both the view of the ball & of Gomez. It also shows the view from behind the goal which is less conclusive but does still look like Sammon runs across Robinson’s line of vision. Robinson’s reactions appear to suggest he only saw the ball late leading me to think his view was blocked & if you look at the 3 blackburn defenders they are all to Robinson’s right & not impeding his view of the shot or the ball. Sammon is more to the left.
The liner should definitely have flagged but whether Marriner would have been in the position to say whether Sammon was interfering with play is another matter.
Kean wouldn’t have been able to see owt at the time & its only the replays that have made him suggest it shouldn’t have been allowed but if I’d been reffing & seen what I’ve seen since then I’d have disallowed it so i think he’s got legitimate grounds to complain – my reaction at the time was that Sammon was offside & interfering with play & was expecting to see the flag raised.
Being a nerdy ref these days I made a point of watching the liner nearest the east stand for tips but I stopped not long after the goal coz I thought he was poorNot spotting the rolling ball for Caldwell’s free kick that led to Crusat’s goal was nearly as bad as not realising the corner hadn’t already been taken by the time Pedersen touched it
Dermot Gallagher has just been on SSN saying that the Gomez goal was a correct decision by the referee
The replay i saw on the concorse tv replay was from the south stand and it showed that sammon was not in Robinsons way the shouting by the goalkeeper was at his defenders for allowing Gomez a free shot and attemting to block the said shot
Learn to deal with it people, we are the 20th best team in the Football league
Precisely – remember once (well, a few times actually) we were 92nd. Or even when we were 100 and something.
Dermot Gallagher has just been on SSN saying that the Gomez goal was a correct decision by the refereeRemember the 07/08 season when Latics played United in the last game with United needing to win to secure the league?
Remember that in that game Paul Scholes was cautioned & then several minutes later committed another foul worthy of a caution yet wasn’t sent off by the referee?
Well the day after that, Dermot Gallagher was on talksport being asked about the decisions given & not given by the ref (Latics were also denied a penalty with the score at 0-0 when Ferdinand blocked a shot with his arm). He said that whilst it was a foul & worthy of a yellow card, sometimes a referee doesn’t just referee the game they referee the occasion and as such the ref was right not to issue a 2nd yellow.My points being that a) he is just as capable of talking absolute rubbish as the rest of us & b) as a former ref & someone the media turn to on occasions like this he is very reluctant to say anything critical of decisions made by match officials.
Alot of football decisions are about interpretation & my veiw of our first goal having seen it at the time & from 3 different angles is that Sammon interfered with play both in terms of his starting position & the run he makes as he tries to get back onside
Some other ref’s would disagree but I know many more that wouldn’t.Just because Robinson has a go at his defence as opposed to appealing for offside doesn’t mean anything when things happen in a split second
The referee didn’t see the corner incident and, therefore, should have consulted his linesman and fourth official. He didn’t. If he had any doubt he should have disallowed the goal and ordered the corner to be taken again.
the referee did see Victor being tripped in the area, but gave nothing.
In my opinion the referee is incompetent and cost us three points.
Frankly I am amazed to see Wigan Athletic fans attempting to defend the referee or refer to other incidents and suggest it’s “swings and roundabouts”. Do you actually call yourselves Wigan Athletic supporters?
On the same subject – any idiots who booed the team off after Saturday’s performance would be better off staying at home.
In 40 years of watching Latics I have never come across so many fans who know so little about the game and supporting your team. I have been involved in major rows when opposition supporters have slagged off my team, but now I am hearing racist, obnoxious comments from a silly minority of fans. The decisions going against us should provide us with a siege mentality, but too many of you have slumped off into a corner and given up. Put up a bit of a fight for God’s sake.
Once again you will tell me it is simply your opinion. Well we have heard it now. The manager is totally committed to Wigan Athletic, the players all gave 110% on Saturday, maybe it is time we were united and gave them our support.
Perhaps it would help.
Booing them certainly doesn’t.
Personally I cant wait for the game when the rub of the green goes our way, dodgy goals, penalties given etc. We will score at least 7.
We dont seem to ge the same level of luck.
The referee didn’t see the corner incident and, therefore, should have consulted his linesman and fourth official. He didn’t. If he had any doubt he should have disallowed the goal and ordered the corner to be taken again.the referee did see Victor being tripped in the area, but gave nothing.
In my opinion the referee is incompetent and cost us three points.
Frankly I am amazed to see Wigan Athletic fans attempting to defend the referee or refer to other incidents and suggest it’s “swings and roundabouts”. Do you actually call yourselves Wigan Athletic supporters?
On the same subject – any idiots who booed the team off after Saturday’s performance would be better off staying at home.
In 40 years of watching Latics I have never come across so many fans who know so little about the game and supporting your team. I have been involved in major rows when opposition supporters have slagged off my team, but now I am hearing racist, obnoxious comments from a silly minority of fans. The decisions going against us should provide us with a siege mentality, but too many of you have slumped off into a corner and given up. Put up a bit of a fight for God’s sake.
Once again you will tell me it is simply your opinion. Well we have heard it now. The manager is totally committed to Wigan Athletic, the players all gave 110% on Saturday, maybe it is time we were united and gave them our support.
Perhaps it would help.
Booing them certainly doesn’t.
Nobody is trying to defend the referee, but the 3 points were lost because of defending errors for the first goal, switching off for the second goal, and twice giving the ball away far to easily and then making commiting stupid fouls, add thsi to the fact al habsi should have caught the first free kick launched into our box instead of punching it(watch a replay),yes the referee was incompedent but he is not the reason we didn’t win.
The refereeing debacle just compounded the poor outcome,without the crap defending we would have been complaining the scoreline should have been 4-0(with the moses penalty)instead of 3-0.
On the point of the booing I dont think much of the booing was aimed at martinez or the team, or it certainly wasnt near where i was, the booing for me was aimed at the inept refereeing you claim lost us the game, the west stand stuff as they were walking off definately was.On your last point the only people who seem to have no fight are those on the field itself, i dont see any of the defenders throwing themselves at the ball to stop the opposition or forwards busting a gut to defend from the front or midfielders getting stuck in and making life hard for opposing players, for me that is actually my biggest critism of this team – it has no fighting spirit whatsoever.
The referee didn’t see the corner incident and, therefore, should have consulted his linesman and fourth official. He didn’t. If he had any doubt he should have disallowed the goal and ordered the corner to be taken again.the referee did see Victor being tripped in the area, but gave nothing.
In my opinion the referee is incompetent and cost us three points.
Frankly I am amazed to see Wigan Athletic fans attempting to defend the referee or refer to other incidents and suggest it’s “swings and roundabouts”. Do you actually call yourselves Wigan Athletic supporters?
On the same subject – any idiots who booed the team off after Saturday’s performance would be better off staying at home.
In 40 years of watching Latics I have never come across so many fans who know so little about the game and supporting your team. I have been involved in major rows when opposition supporters have slagged off my team, but now I am hearing racist, obnoxious comments from a silly minority of fans. The decisions going against us should provide us with a siege mentality, but too many of you have slumped off into a corner and given up. Put up a bit of a fight for God’s sake.
Once again you will tell me it is simply your opinion. Well we have heard it now. The manager is totally committed to Wigan Athletic, the players all gave 110% on Saturday, maybe it is time we were united and gave them our support.
Perhaps it would help.
Booing them certainly doesn’t.
The officials are all mic’d up so I’d imagine that the question was asked. Expecting the fourth official & linesman who would have been stood near the dug outs to have seen it is probably a bit much though. In that area of the pitch it was the ref’s responsibility & he’s turned his back to the ball & so couldn’t tell. It was very poor refereeing but you cannot expect ref’s to start pulling play up coz they suspect something may have happened. If you see it you can give it, if you don’t see it (which he didn’t) you can’t give it. Simple as
From the ref’s position it was a very poor decision not to give the penalty – no arguments there
The referee had a shocker on Saturday IMO but you can’t escape the fact that some of his errors benefitted Latics just as much as they went against em. If you look at the 2nd goal incident, yes it cost us 3 points but if you look at the match as a whole including all his decisions as well as glaring misses from Latics players then no it didn’t cost us 3 points.
I’ve been a Latics fan for nigh on 25 years but being a supporter doesn’t mean only castigating the ref if decisions go against us & ignoring the ones in our favour. There’s being a supporter & then there’s being blind to the factsFor what its worth i thought the majority of the players were superb on Saturday & I don’t think the commitment could be questioned even for those who weren’t.
It was also a very entertaining game & how I like to see my football. For 2 of the goals it was good to see Latics players getting on to the 2nd ball & knock downs & seeing the midfield up in support of the strikerOh & I might be wrong but I think the vast majority of booing at the final whistle was towards the referee as the majority sat down round me (far end of the east stand from where the penalty was given) had no idea what he’d given the penalty for which coupled with their 2nd goal & our non-penalty left alot feeling aggrieved
Remember the 07/08 season when Latics played United in the last game with United needing to win to secure the league?
Remember that in that game Paul Scholes was cautioned & then several minutes later committed another foul worthy of a caution yet wasn’t sent off by the referee?
Well the day after that, Dermot Gallagher was on talksport being asked about the decisions given & not given by the ref (Latics were also denied a penalty with the score at 0-0 when Ferdinand blocked a shot with his arm). He said that whilst it was a foul & worthy of a yellow card, sometimes a referee doesn’t just referee the game they referee the occasion and as such the ref was right not to issue a 2nd yellow.My points being that a) he is just as capable of talking absolute rubbish as the rest of us & b) as a former ref & someone the media turn to on occasions like this he is very reluctant to say anything critical of decisions made by match officials.
Alot of football decisions are about interpretation & my veiw of our first goal having seen it at the time & from 3 different angles is that Sammon interfered with play both in terms of his starting position & the run he makes as he tries to get back onside
Some other ref’s would disagree but I know many more that wouldn’t.Just because Robinson has a go at his defence as opposed to appealing for offside doesn’t mean anything when things happen in a split second
I cannot see how you can compare the validity of the Gomez goal or the “rolling ball” goal with the Blackburn goal from the corner. Whether you consider Gallagher to be right or wrong I don’t see how either the linesman or the referee – from where he was stood – could possibly determine that Sammon was interfering with play whilst being in an offside position. I tend to agree with you that the goal should have been ruled out but I can fully understand why it wasn’t. Similar incidents happen in games every week and goals are given.
The rolling ball was a marginal thing and it was barely moving when Caldwell took the free kick so again I can understand why the referee didn’t spot it. It doesn’t make it right but it was an understandable error. I should also add that there were other incidents during the game where free kicks were taken with a rolling ball. Sometimes referees aren’t particular bothered about those kind of things if it means keeping the game moving, in much the same way as not being too pedantic about having the majority of free kicks taken from the right place.
However, the corner incident was a gross error of judgement and even if Yakubu had touched the ball it should still have been ruled out for ungentlemanly conduct or whatever the term may be for trying to gain an unfair advantage.And finally, of course all this doesn’t detract from the very obvious fact that the team is where it is because it can’t defend and see out a game. However, I can also understand Martinez being particularly miffed about conceding a goal as a result of such a blatant refereeing error.
If you can understand why the offside wasn’t given coz the ref couldn’t determine whether he was interfering with play from his position then I fail to understand why you can’t see that the ref didn’t order the corner to be retaken from his position as he quite clearly had his back to the corner when Pedersen started his run & so hadn’t seen what had gone on.
Just as he may not have been able to tell Sammon was interfering with play he had no idea what happened in relation to the corner & so had no option but to allow play to continue. It was really bad refereeing but he didn’t see what went on so he couldn’t give anything but the goal.
Same with Gomez’s goal particularly if his liner didn’t help him out by indicating he was in an offside position in the first place
If a ref sees a moving ball at a free kick they always pull it up. They, in my experience of working with them, only don’t pull a team up for it if they don’t see it & hence we’re back to the same scenario as for the corner. In this instance the ref had his back to play when the kick was takenI didn’t agree with him but I’m pretty sure that the co-commentator on Sky thought Dunn got the ball in the challenge that he received his second caution for & that the ref got the decision wrong coz he was in the wrong position & couldn’t see it
I think anyone who went to the game on saturday and claims the second goal should have been disallowed are missing the point by a country mile, not one person in the ground complained about that corner.
In actual fact nobody knew what had gone on until they saw TV replays later, I have stated in another post a chap near me shouted “watch out that ball has been tapped forward”, we all thought it was a clever move and sloppy defending, so how can the andre marriner be blamed for missing something everyone else missed as well.
One of the main things that did not happen and was brought up on MOD2 last night ‘not one wigan player complained to the referee’.
Martinez said later “this was because he does not allow them harass the officials”, but they certainly all complained and harassed the referee when he awarded the penalty at the end.The reason they didnt do anything about the corner is they themselves thought it was a perfectly good goal.
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