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Well the MOTD pundits showed the viewers with the aid of their playback software just how City DID stretch us ! The camera never lies Johnny ! ;)
I wouldn’t say that either goal came because City stretched Latics defence.
For one of them (can’t remember whether it was the 1st or 2nd) City went on the attack coz Gomez gave the ball away very sloppily in the centre of the park & it meant from Latics looking to go forward they were suddenly on the back foot & City had the momentum. I guess you can call that being stretched to some extent but not coz of any tactical genius on Mancini’s part but coz of a mistake on Latics part.
The 1st then came quite simply because Al Habsi fumbled the ball & then got caught in 2 minds as to the best course of action to rectify that
The 2nd one I don’t feel came coz Latics were stretched at all but because 5 Latics players got sucked into trying to get the ball off Da Silva/Silva (I think) whoever. They still managed to leave a gaping hole for him to pass through & City then had 3 men marked on the edge of the areaNo stretching there as far as I can see but 2 mistakes in & around Latics own box that a quality side like City were able to capitalise on.
BTW Filmoss – I’ve only used a quote from you coz it was the one I could see with the clearest mention of what some pundits had said. It’s not meant to be any dig at you
My big question is:We are 2-0 down. Two minutes of injury time have been played out of three. And you decide to bring a sub on – but instead of doing it quickly you give him more instructions.
Just WHAT instructions was he giving him?
“Now listen, Callum. I want you to run onto the pitch. Listen carefully and in a minute you will hear the referee blow his whistle long. When that happens – come back to the tunnel.”
In my 33 years of watchign football that has to go down as the most bizarre substitution I have ever seen – If your team is a goal up or clingign on for a draw then I can see the point in order to kill some time but when you’re 2-0 down with under 30 seconds to go?? Very strange
Should we have had a pen for the foul on Gomez?No – There was some contact in there, but not all contact in football is a foul as people’s legs/arms/bodies naturally clash
On top of that Gomez didn’t go over till well after any contact was made
Lemur – I’d blame Ali for the 1st coz although he did well to get to the 2nd shot, the 1st one should have presented no problem to him but he spilt it. He then came out to collect the loose ball & in that situation a keeper should just steam & take out ball/defenders/attackers but he didn’t, he hesitated (possibly coz Lopez was in his way) & Balotelli got the ball.
He’s saved Latics often enough like so hope they’re exceptions to the rule & don’t become more frequentIt was also probably completely lost on the West Ham fans doing it that their jewish owner & jewish midfielder might have been somewhat offended & upset by it too :pinch: :pinch:
Also neither zyklon-B or the exhaust fumes used at the death camps “hissed” so what are they making the noise for anyway??
In my student days I once got caught short & had to dive in a place called The Bear in Aberystwyth to use the crapper.
If you’ve ever seen the bit in Trainspotting where Renton has to use the toilet in the bookies, this particular bog put that one to shame.
Still needs must & all thatThe actual pub was alreet but I still have flashbacks about that toilet
Other than that any Robinsons pub is usually an absolute dump whilst Samuel Smiths pubs generally leave bad impressions coz the lager is downright awful
As i stated in the post I am NOT criticising/slating either of the 2 aforementioned players, but people slate Gomez for things that other players are more guilty of!Also I wasn’t attempting to take any ‘moral highground’.. Just voicing my opinion.
I’m sorry but even if you put “Not slating these players, but” at the start of a sentence, if you then go on to say “they don’t even look forwards” then you are criticising them. How could it not be?? It’s like when someone says “I’m not taking the pish, but..” & then proceeds to take the pish
I get your general point but people have opinions just like you. You like Gomez & think he’s a good player, some other people don’t. Those who booed Gomez in the 1st half on Saturday were merely exercising their right to voice their opinions on him just like you have about McCarthy & McArthur (albeit on a different forum)
For what it’s worth i did used to boo players & heckle them during the match but have long since realised how counter productive that can be as well as making you look an absolute plum when said player goes & bags a hat-trick or is announced over the tannoy as the man of the match after you’ve just spent the previous 80+ minutes slating him, loudly (as happened to me when I did it to Greenall in the league game v City back in 1998 at Springfield Park).
Backward facing game??!! He fed Kone through numerous times with ‘forward’ balls.
Not slating these players, but if you want to talk about a backward facing game look at McCarthy and McArthur! I know they ARE more defensive players but still, they don’t even look forwards! You can’t use that to criticise Gomez as it isn’t true, specially when comparing him to other players!Any moral high ground you may have felt you had in this thread by criticising those who criticse Gomez disappeared in an instant the moment that you decided to criticise McCarthy & McArthur for somet which quite frankly as much b0ll0x as it is to accuse Gomez of never passing forwards
My own opinion of Gomez is that you can see that he has a touch of class about him but in general he can be too slow in speed of movement & thought & although I see his value as a squad player, if everyone is fully fit then he should be a bench player.
That’s just my opinion though & a mate fo mine think’s he’s a class act all roundi think the reason why he gets more stick than other players & why any mistakes he makes are pilloried more than those of other players is that he isn’t one of those players who will “get stuck in where it hurts” – whether that’s actual fact or an impression he gives off is another debate. Some people interpret that aspect of his game as a lack of effort or commitment to the blue & white cause and “we can take a lack of skill but not a lack of effort
It’s happened all the time I’ve been watching Latics & the reason why (off the top of my head) Paul Cook, Gary Teale, Jordi Gomez etc.. have all got plenty of stick off the crowd but the likes of Lee McCulloch & Neil Roberts haven’t
Presumably on the Friday he attended training & wasn’t out beyond any club enforced curfew. That being the case & assuming, that as it was a muslim wedding, he didn’t get leathered I don’t see what difference him getting married the day before a game made. He may well have eaten, had a dance & got a bit of how’s your father but then (dancing apart) I’m sure most of the players did that day.
In the long term I doubt one iota that convertign to Islam made any difference to his capabilities as a footballer. There are plenty of muslim footballers the world over including some who are/have been amongst the best in the world.
And again, Nathan Ellington made the decision to become a Muslim, no-one elseThe way some people are talking its as if he’s some kind of mindless automoton
And conversely Tyldesley, you’re making him sound like a maverick with scant regard for protocol or authority!
My point is – as you well know – yes the player has the final decision in the destiny, but many of them trust their agents and advisers so implicitly that they’ll follow their instructions without question.
Incidentally I was told last night by someone that reads this forum that Ellington’s conversion to Islam was heavily influenced by his brother who’d converted some time before him. Again it was his final decision to do so, but it was hardly a show of individualism.[/quote]
Its not my intention to make him sound like anything other than a normal person like everybody else who just happened to be half decent at football
Even if the story you’ve just put about his conversion to a religion is true down to the last letter & even if he is/was one of these players who does everything his agent says coz he trusts him implicitly then the fault for anything that goes wrong/right with his life/career as a result of those decisions is still solely Nathan Ellington’s fault & no-one elsesPersonally with regards to whether he’d have been good for Latics in the top flight, I have my doubts. I think some people have let time mist what he was like as a player – yes he was capable of looking top drawer but he was also equally capable of going for long stretches of looking like he had the talent of Phil Daley. Look at his goalscoring record for Latics. His goals came in gluts so he’d score say 6 in 8 then go 6 games without a goal then get 5 in 6, go 7 games without a goal etc.. I remember an away game one evening at Stockport (which division we were in escapes me) & he missed an absolute sitter when he was 1 on 1 with the keeper. he had a stinker the next game too at the JJB & as I was coming away from the game I lost count of the number of people slating him & saying Jewell should drop him. And lets not forget that Jewell dropped him at the back end of the championship promotion season in favour of Brett Ormerod for a couple of games coz his form had dipped
So he was never guaranteed to be good at this level. he was one of the ultimate confidence players – if it was high then nowt could stop him, but if the goals dried up his head dropped & his effort levels fell too. His problem at WBA was that Robson was never prepared to give him a run of games to overcome that dip & he was in & out of the side. Now Jewell may well have persevered with him if he’s started the season badly but I see no evidence that if he’d come good that he would have maintained that constantly because he hadn’t done beforeWho is going to want to work for Abramovich?With the exception of a few I’d say virtually every manager in world football would jump at the chance.
He pays top whack wages & if/when he sacks you, you get that wopping great contract paid off to you anyway.
I’d snap his hand offin a 4-4-2 I’d plump for:
1 – Roy Carroll
2 – Pascal Chimbonda
3 – Leighton Baines
4 – Peter Atherton
5 – Arjan De Zeeuw
6 – Joe Parkinson
7 – Luis Antonio Valencia
8 – Jimmy Bullard
9 – Jason Roberts
10 – Emile Heskey
11 – Charles N’ZogbiaWhat about the muslim? The one who Ellington married….on the Friday before a game. (Really good for a player, that)Surely all that business played a big part in it all?
Presumably on the Friday he attended training & wasn’t out beyond any club enforced curfew. That being the case & assuming, that as it was a muslim wedding, he didn’t get leathered I don’t see what difference him getting married the day before a game made. He may well have eaten, had a dance & got a bit of how’s your father but then (dancing apart) I’m sure most of the players did that day.
In the long term I doubt one iota that convertign to Islam made any difference to his capabilities as a footballer. There are plenty of muslim footballers the world over including some who are/have been amongst the best in the world.
And again, Nathan Ellington made the decision to become a Muslim, no-one elseThe way some people are talking its as if he’s some kind of mindless automoton
“He married a Muslim girl and HE converted to Islam. It’s hardly a show of independence – more a demonstration of him acceding to the wishes of his wife to be and her family. He also didn’t have the gumption or bottle to tell the club that what he was doing the day before a game, which is not really an indicator of intelligence”
It’s no more a demonstartion that he acceded to the wishes of his wife & her family than it’s demonstration that he felt passionately about Islam & happened to fall in love with someone also of that faith.
Likewise with the date of the marriage it could also be an indication that he had the strength of character to think that it’s got feck all to do with them (which ultimately it hasn’t), I won’t be drinking & I won’t be out beyond my pre-match curfew so I won’t tell them as the only reason it will be an issue is coz of the religion it involves.“Yes, they do have the opportunity to say no to their agents, but many of them won’t” – that just shows that essentially we’re in agreement. They can say no in instances like this but they choose not to (or these 2 did anyway). I’ve no doubt that I (& millions of other people) have made decisions based on advice we received from people we trusted implicitly that turned out to be b0ll0x but at the end of the day no matter who that advice was from & how qualified they were to give it we could still have said no so the blame for owt that goes wrong lies with us
ABL…I visited Normandy this year,Pegasus bridge,beaches,cemeteries,museums oh and a few vineyards.Very humbling what these guys did should never be forgotten and schools should be taught this history and realise that we were great once.Visit when you can pal.
I would like to see Pegasus Bridge, definitely. Probably the first soldier to die on D Day died there, Lt Den Brotheridge. He was killed as he led his men from the Gliders, onto Pegasus Bridge. Hit in the throat, I think.
My problem with Normandy is that I would like to see ALL of it….and I believe it’s an area of around 50 miles. (think Wigan to Stoke)My big interest being the U.S. Airborne, I would start my tour on the Cotentin Peninsula, around St Mere Eglise, through St Marie Du Mont and St Come Du Mont, down to Carentan. I DEFINITELY want to see Brecourt Manor, where Easy Co, led by Lt Richard Winters, took out the battery of guns on D Day morning. (Parts of the guns are still at Brecourt Manor)
I would like to follow the route of Easy Co and visit the places above, then Son and Eindhoven in the Netherlands, Bastogne and Foy-Noville in Belgium, Haguenau in France, and on into Germany and Hitler’s Eagles Nest mountain top retreat in Bavaria, at Berchtesgaden. Then finish off in the very picturesque looking Zell Am See, in Austria. I’d find that very interesting….not sure the family would be as keen though! Lol.Would love to see the majority of the Normandy battlegrounds, definitely. I also fancy sampling the local food and drink too.[/quote]
As a 10yr old I went on a family holiday to Normandy. It wasn’t to see any of that stuff but my grandad (who had landed on the beaches on D-Day) came along & we went to some of these places such as the beach he landed on, the cemetaries, loads of other places whose names have all escaped me other than St Lo & St Marie Eglise – if I remember rightly St marie Eglise is the village where the American para’s dropped in on & one of them got his parachute caught on the church spire & spent God knows how long dangling up there whilst it was going off all around him. The church now has (or did have back in 1985) a model of him hanging off the church, the town’s crest has been changed to show parachute symbols & there’s a WWII museum there
I regret that he died before I got the chance to go back there (& Nijmegen/Arnhem where he was injured) with him when I would have really appreciated it rather than as a 10 yr old who just got a bit bored.Went to Auschwitz & Krakow a few years back – horrendous place but somewhere I think everyone should go to at least once
Anyway away from football I’m into my funk & my history
