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Really want to go but it clashes with my wedding anniversary.
To save on a costly divorce I came up with the plan of taking the family along & having a weekend away but the cost of travel down & back, match tickets, hotel (2 nights), a “show”, eating out, travel round London & other odds & sods is taking it out of my reach financially after having already forked out for 2 Wembley trips for myself & a family holiday
Looks like I’ll be watching this one at homeNot regulars so they wont be MISSED :lol:And if the “regulars” get injured who exactly are Latics going to call upon? There’s no guarantee that whoever Coyle brings in us going to be anywhere near as good as those who have left were – especially if his signing of the likes of Mears, Ngog, Eagles & preference of Bogdan over Al Habsi & Jaskelinen is anything to go by
For me what he did at Bolton is irrelevant in our situation. The important thing on his CV is taking Burnley out of the Championship.People seem to be forgetting that’s where we are, and that’s what we need from a manager.
The many Bolton fans I know think he was on the verge of taking them out of the Championship too!!!!
If I could have chosen a list of managers I didn’t want to replace Bobby, Owen Coyle would have been top of it. Here’s to hoping that I’m proved wrong
Looks like planning permission for the training facilities was granted yesterday.Well, there’s a surprise….
Subject to any legal challenges, judicial reviews & all that $h!te
Hmm – intriguing conspiracy theory there Griff! But Bob must have known last summer what the deal was as that’s when asked DW for the training facility. Am also very surprised that they haven’t got planning yet – I thought it was supposed to be ready by the start of the new season?
I also wouldn’t trust anything DW says as far as I could throw him – remember the stuff he said about Jewell’s health and then PJ the next day saying he didn’t know what DW was on about. And let’s not mention the war chest ;)
That said, I think Bob will stay, but for much simpler reasons…a combination of love and guilt. A bit like when you’re the reason your bird is now fat, but there’s no way you can dump her for a better offer cos of what it’ll do to her ;)
Whelan only said he looked a little down that season and seemed exhausted.
But we all know why he was really exhausted the dirty little bugger.[/quote]
Stop!!!!! I’m still having nightmares some 6 years later from seeing Jewell’s gurning sex face staring back at me when I opened up my Sunday rag!!
Is he getting a new deal or does his current one still have time left on it?
I don’t doubt his poor form for a lot of this season was down to his hip/s & he deserves credit for soldiering on to help Latics when we had numerous other defenders out earlier in the season as it probably made his problem worse & he carried on until his body gave in & his lack of mobility started to become more & more costly
He’s had a hip op before though & come back to claim a player of the year award so if another op will solve the problem & allow him to return at the start of next season I would be more than happy to see him backI hope you enjoyed your trawl for that information.Shame I didn’t read any of it.
Goodnight.
No need to trawl, unlike you so it seems I am able to remember actual scorelines & not make stuff up in my head
And thanks for showing that you are one of those people who when faced with facts that contradict their belief simply stick their fingers in their ears & scream la la la – nice oneWhether the club could afford it is another matter
One that should not be brushed aside as you are teetering at the fact Bruce was a better Manager for us than Roberto.
Bruce would of took us down had he stayed and we would be in a much worse position than we are right now.[/quote]
I haven’t said anywhere on this thread that I thought Bruce was a better Latics manager than bobby is. Nor have i hinted that’s what I think
To be honest you can’t compare the 2 – Bruce achieved much better league positions but he operated under a far bigger budget nor did he win a major cup or beat the “big boys”
Some times I preferred the style of football under Bruce but some times the football produced under Bobby has wiped the floor with it (& vice versa)
All I’ve done is defend Titus Bramble & state that under Bruce he was superb & he was. In fact the whole defence was & you can’t get away from that fact. Under Martinez’s defensive system pretty much the same defence conceded more goals in 3 months than they had in the previous season under Bruce but on the flip side Bobby’s teams have scored more goals
However just as you can’t use Bobby’s poorer league finishes to say he is a poorer manager (due to the difference in budgets) nor IMO can you say the Bruce would definitely have got Latics relegated (do you have the ability to travel back & forth between other realities?)
Nor can you say Latics would have been in a far worse position – he’d have had to operate under the same budget constraints & again you/we have no idea of the players he’d have signed or how he’d have attempted to re-structure the club[/quote]Of course you can compare the two you just did!!!!
Bruce is only good with money to spend, its why he jumped ship once he realised Whelan would no longer fund the plus signs on his CV!
His transfer record is absolutely terrible.
Putting aside the melons he signed for us and Sunderland he once again has thrown money at the situation to get Hull out of the Championship.
He spent a shit load of money here and he amounted to nothing.
Roberto operated under a third of his budget and won the FA cup.[/quote]
You’re completely misreading my post or I haven’t made it clear enough – I wasn’t attempting to say one was better than the other but that they achieved things the other didn’t but operated under different eras financially. One did far better in the league the other fix far better in the cup
I can see the plus & minus points for them both whereas you just seem completely blinkered to be honestWhilst not saying one is better than the other I will defend Bruce against some of the things you said:
“He spent a shit load of money here & amounted to nothing” – for a start he turned round the absolute disaster that was Hutchings reign in a matter of weeks & in the second half of that first season the form of the team was better than anything outside of the top 4. The following season that continued & he had Latics heading fit Europe until Dave Whelan changed the goalposts for the club financially & sold his team out from under him despite Bruce having come out publicly & said he would be jnsane to even consider selling any if his players. That & the chairman stating “job done lets look at next season” in early January contributed as much to the 2nd half slump as anything else yet they still managed Latics 2nd highest league finish ever. Hardly nothing!!!
Yes Bruce signed some players who turned out to be rights bags if shit but as someone has pointed out on this or another thread, so has Alex Ferguson. So has Bobby including Latics record ever signing. Bruce also signed some quality players just as Bobby has
Yes Bruce never won an FA Cup whilst in charge of Latics but he never got us relegated either[/quote]Believe it or not I am not analysing everything you say and replying directly to it.
People who hold Bruce in high esteem are often clutching to the fact of one good league position.
If I could be arsed I could easily demonstrate Bruces terrible transfer record on a season by season basis and to compare to the likes of Ferguson’s is absolutely ridiculous.
Bruce left us in a worse position as a club TWICE.
He won no silverware.
He failed to do anything other than bend over when we played any of the so called “big clubs”
Once he left he poached one of the only decent signings he ever made!
He preceded to bad mouth the club with a number of disrespectful comments after he had left.
There is your comparison and quite frankly Bruce can go arouse himself for all I care he didn’t give two cacks about this club and it winds me up when people lick his bumhole as if he did anything other than use us as a career stepping stone TWICE!!![/quote]
Then to be honest it’s impossible to have a reasoned debate with you about his record as your dislike for him as a person is completely blinding you to anything he did or didn’t do as a football manager
For what it’s worth I agree with your sentiments about him & how he treated the club but it doesn’t stop me seeing the good (& bad) that he did. And likewise I think Bobby is a great guy with genuine live for the club but I can see the bad (& good) that he does.
Just to highlight this point Steve Bruce got us a draw away at Chelsea (the same place Latics lost 8-0 the season after), came within a very poor refs decision of getting an away win @ Anfield, beat Spurs, drew @ Anfield, drew with Liverpool home etc ..
Against United Bruce had a record of 1 goal for & 5 against in 3 games so per game that’s 0.33 for & 1.7 against & the team never conceded more than 2 in a game. Under Bobby Latics have scored 1 & conceded 29 in 8 games. Per game that’s 0.13 for & 3.6 against & have lost 5-0 3 times & 4-0 3 times. Yet it’s Steve Bruce’s teams you accuse of bending over for the big boys!!! It beggars belief you can be so blinded!!!Whether the club could afford it is another matter
One that should not be brushed aside as you are teetering at the fact Bruce was a better Manager for us than Roberto.
Bruce would of took us down had he stayed and we would be in a much worse position than we are right now.[/quote]
I haven’t said anywhere on this thread that I thought Bruce was a better Latics manager than bobby is. Nor have i hinted that’s what I think
To be honest you can’t compare the 2 – Bruce achieved much better league positions but he operated under a far bigger budget nor did he win a major cup or beat the “big boys”
Some times I preferred the style of football under Bruce but some times the football produced under Bobby has wiped the floor with it (& vice versa)
All I’ve done is defend Titus Bramble & state that under Bruce he was superb & he was. In fact the whole defence was & you can’t get away from that fact. Under Martinez’s defensive system pretty much the same defence conceded more goals in 3 months than they had in the previous season under Bruce but on the flip side Bobby’s teams have scored more goals
However just as you can’t use Bobby’s poorer league finishes to say he is a poorer manager (due to the difference in budgets) nor IMO can you say the Bruce would definitely have got Latics relegated (do you have the ability to travel back & forth between other realities?)
Nor can you say Latics would have been in a far worse position – he’d have had to operate under the same budget constraints & again you/we have no idea of the players he’d have signed or how he’d have attempted to re-structure the club[/quote]Of course you can compare the two you just did!!!!
Bruce is only good with money to spend, its why he jumped ship once he realised Whelan would no longer fund the plus signs on his CV!
His transfer record is absolutely terrible.
Putting aside the melons he signed for us and Sunderland he once again has thrown money at the situation to get Hull out of the Championship.
He spent a shit load of money here and he amounted to nothing.
Roberto operated under a third of his budget and won the FA cup.[/quote]
You’re completely misreading my post or I haven’t made it clear enough – I wasn’t attempting to say one was better than the other but that they achieved things the other didn’t but operated under different eras financially. One did far better in the league the other fix far better in the cup
I can see the plus & minus points for them both whereas you just seem completely blinkered to be honestWhilst not saying one is better than the other I will defend Bruce against some of the things you said:
“He spent a shit load of money here & amounted to nothing” – for a start he turned round the absolute disaster that was Hutchings reign in a matter of weeks & in the second half of that first season the form of the team was better than anything outside of the top 4. The following season that continued & he had Latics heading fit Europe until Dave Whelan changed the goalposts for the club financially & sold his team out from under him despite Bruce having come out publicly & said he would be jnsane to even consider selling any if his players. That & the chairman stating “job done lets look at next season” in early January contributed as much to the 2nd half slump as anything else yet they still managed Latics 2nd highest league finish ever. Hardly nothing!!!
Yes Bruce signed some players who turned out to be rights bags if shit but as someone has pointed out on this or another thread, so has Alex Ferguson. So has Bobby including Latics record ever signing. Bruce also signed some quality players just as Bobby has
Yes Bruce never won an FA Cup whilst in charge of Latics but he never got us relegated eitherDont want to keep pulling you up on this but seeing as you think Ellington was over rated and Bramble was an “absolute rock” I think you need to go and get your head checked.Sorry but if you don’t think that a centre half who was an integral part of the 7th best defence in the league that season was a rock then it is you who needs your head checking
admittedly under Hutchings & Bobby he was crap as both tried to play systems for which he didn’t have the skill set. Bruce got him to play to his strengths & was rewarded for it
As for Ellington, his career post-Latics shows you whether he was over-rated or notWhether the club could afford it is another matter
One that should not be brushed aside as you are teetering at the fact Bruce was a better Manager for us than Roberto.
Bruce would of took us down had he stayed and we would be in a much worse position than we are right now.[/quote]
I haven’t said anywhere on this thread that I thought Bruce was a better Latics manager than bobby is. Nor have i hinted that’s what I think
To be honest you can’t compare the 2 – Bruce achieved much better league positions but he operated under a far bigger budget nor did he win a major cup or beat the “big boys”
Some times I preferred the style of football under Bruce but some times the football produced under Bobby has wiped the floor with it (& vice versa)
All I’ve done is defend Titus Bramble & state that under Bruce he was superb & he was. In fact the whole defence was & you can’t get away from that fact. Under Martinez’s defensive system pretty much the same defence conceded more goals in 3 months than they had in the previous season under Bruce but on the flip side Bobby’s teams have scored more goals
However just as you can’t use Bobby’s poorer league finishes to say he is a poorer manager (due to the difference in budgets) nor IMO can you say the Bruce would definitely have got Latics relegated (do you have the ability to travel back & forth between other realities?)
Nor can you say Latics would have been in a far worse position – he’d have had to operate under the same budget constraints & again you/we have no idea of the players he’d have signed or how he’d have attempted to re-structure the clubTalking of stats there’s a lot of moaning about tippy-tappy football, lack of fire-power, too slow thro’ midfield etc. etc. Then there’s the comparison with Swansea, the fire-power of Benteke & Michu etc. et bloody cetera..
Well we scored 47 goals this season, same as Swansea & Villa
more than West Ham (45), Norwich (41), Stoke (34), Newcastle (45) & Sunderland (41) and of course more than QPR & ReadingThese facts seem to show very little wrong with us going forward. As has been repeatedly pointed out the problem has been in defence.
Dark-siders will say that’s cos Martinez is a clown
Light-siders will say that’s cos of injuries to defenders.Pays your money, have your moan but don’t let the facts get in the way.
Exactly, it was Latics best top flight season in terms of going forward but if you’re going to need (on average) to score 2 goals every game just to get a point then you’re going down. Only United scored at a rate of 2+ a game on average
Where do I stand on what was to blame? On the fence – I don’t think the injuries helped in so much as Latics never got to play their strongest defensive line up & playing together does help partnerships develop, but playing behind a settled back line wouldn’t have stopped the countless times Al Habsi palmed shots straight back into the danger zone, or Figueroa & Robles messing about with it at the back against Spurs, or Caldwell giving the ball away to Swansea to let em back into the game, or Scharner getting just about nothing right in the game at Arsenal last week, or McArthur making a mess of a defensive header against Swansea he week before, or Scharner getting caught in possession at WBA to let em go 2-1 up, or only managing a point against 10 men QPR & on & on[/quote]
To be fair, if we hadn’t had the injuries, Scharner wouldn’t have even been here to make those cock-ups[/quote]
That was kind of what I meant by never being able to put out our strongest defensive line up out but injuries don’t excuse the fact that some of the errors made have no place on a schoolboy pitch never mind the top flight
Or as the last poster says the basic mistakes from Al Habsi
Injuries can be used to some extent but not so far as to absolve the management & individuals of blameMy comment was not so much about the quality of the defence under Bruce, more that costs of it. Pay higher wages, you are more likely to get better quality.The first bit was
The second bit seemed like a dig at paying that much for a player of Bramble’s ability. I’d say he was more than worth it under Bruce in comparison to the salary of some other footballers
Whether the club could afford it is another matter
